one more electrical question

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one more electrical question

Jacob-73
Rearranging the electrical divices

I'm planning to rearrange all the electrical devices underneath the seat. I would like to move the lot into the left side tool box together with the ignition coil.
The question is: wiil the ignition coil and especially the HT lead interfere with the rectifier, regulator, head lamp ACDC regulator and flasher unit if the are placed too close to each other?

Thanks for all inputs.

All the best

Jacob, Bulleteering in Denmark

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Re: one more electrical question

David Kelleher
Its possible to get a combined Rectifier/Regulator unit which will save space for you.

 Daithi

----- Original Message -----
From: Jacob
Sent: 10/08/12 07:39 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [Enfield] one more electrical question

 Rearranging the electrical divices

 I'm planning to rearrange all the electrical devices underneath the seat. I would like to move the lot into the left side tool box together with the ignition coil.
 The question is: wiil the ignition coil and especially the HT lead interfere with the rectifier, regulator, head lamp ACDC regulator and flasher unit if the are placed too close to each other?

 Thanks for all inputs.

 All the best

 Jacob, Bulleteering in Denmark

 
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Re: one more electrical question

Jacob-73
Hi Daithi

Thanks for reply. Yes, I've seen one of those in Mr. H catalogue, but my concern isn't really space.
Heat or, even worse, electrical disturbence/ma of devices placed next to the HT lead is an issue of more importance to me. It would be foolish to ruin, let's say the flasher unit, just because it sits next to the HT lead or ruin the rectifier/regulator because it gets overheated. It could also be a malfuntioning flasher unit caused by the high voltage pulsing of the ignition coil.
Right now everything is placed in the open and with adequate space between them. This could be because it is technically required or a just practical use of the space. If the latter is the case, I would for practical reasons move all this stuff into the tool box. It will be in the dry, out of the way and easy to attend if necessary.

Jacob

--- In [hidden email], "David Kelleher" <websys@...> wrote:

>
> Its possible to get a combined Rectifier/Regulator unit which will save space for you.
>
>  Daithi
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Jacob
> Sent: 10/08/12 07:39 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [Enfield] one more electrical question
>
>  Rearranging the electrical divices
>
>  I'm planning to rearrange all the electrical devices underneath the seat. I would like to move the lot into the left side tool box together with the ignition coil.
>  The question is: wiil the ignition coil and especially the HT lead interfere with the rectifier, regulator, head lamp ACDC regulator and flasher unit if the are placed too close to each other?
>
>  Thanks for all inputs.
>
>  All the best
>
>  Jacob, Bulleteering in Denmark
>


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Re: one more electrical question

JOHN MEAD
In reply to this post by David Kelleher
Podtronics

John Mead



--- On Mon, 10/8/12, David Kelleher <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: David Kelleher <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [Enfield] one more electrical question
To: [hidden email]
Date: Monday, October 8, 2012, 3:57 PM










       



















Its possible to get a combined Rectifier/Regulator unit which will save space for you.
 

 
Daithi
 

 
 
         
 
         
                ----- Original Message -----
         
                From: Jacob
         
                Sent: 10/08/12 07:39 PM
         
                To: [hidden email]
         
                Subject: [Enfield] one more electrical question
       
 
         
                 
                 
                         
                                 
                                         
                                                Rearranging the electrical divices
 
                                               
 
                                                I'm planning to rearrange all the electrical devices underneath the seat. I would like to move the lot into the left side tool box together with the ignition coil.
 
                                                The question is: wiil the ignition coil and especially the HT lead interfere with the rectifier, regulator, head lamp ACDC regulator and flasher unit if the are placed too close to each other?
 
                                               
 
                                                Thanks for all inputs.
 
                                               
 
                                                All the best
 
                                               
 
                                                Jacob, Bulleteering in Denmark
 
                                                 
                                 
                                 
                                         
         
 
 
         










   
   










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Re: one more electrical question

lee eldridge
In reply to this post by Jacob-73
Good idea  to keep the coil HT away from everything. A spark over is the worst issue as it MIGHT destroy the semiconductor devices. Unlikely but possible.

If you have a traditional machine there is very little the radiation from the HT lead or breakers lead can upset. If there is a computer or "high tech" flasher then you may have issues. simple rectifiers, shunt regulators (lamp regulator) are passive devices and are unlikely to be interfered with. The regulator for the rest is also comprised of mostly passive devices but the SCR MAY see a trigger but I have experience designing control circuits for lasers that had 100kv pulses (bike is at best 40kv) and the SCR circuits ran without an issue unlike the "digital" systems that were always failing.

The breakers lead carries high currents that can induce a signal into the other wires. It is best t keep this away rom other stuff. Usually with these machines where the frame is ground return, you cannot twist with ground wire to cancel the magnetic field. No point putting shielding.

The radiation from the HT lead is electric so shielding could work but keeping the isolation distances is hard. Selecting the right shield material is hard. Every time you double the distance from the HT lead to the equipment and wires you reduce the field by 4 times so every bit of spacing is good.


Lee Eldridge
Australia
[hidden email]
0427874796





On 09/10/2012, at 5:39 AM, Jacob wrote:

> Rearranging the electrical divices
>
> I'm planning to rearrange all the electrical devices underneath the seat. I would like to move the lot into the left side tool box together with the ignition coil.
> The question is: wiil the ignition coil and especially the HT lead interfere with the rectifier, regulator, head lamp ACDC regulator and flasher unit if the are placed too close to each other?
>
> Thanks for all inputs.
>
> All the best
>
> Jacob, Bulleteering in Denmark
>
>

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Re: one more electrical question

Jacob-73
John, I have checked out the Podtronic. Smart little thing. On the US web site it says not to install in in a closed room (tool box). At a british web site it says: install it in the tool box and get rid of it. This sort of little divice it something to go on with.

Lee, thank you for the technical explanation. This is something that really makes me understand the different problems to be aware of when my electrcal rebuild is going to take places. I have LED flashers with a flasher unit to go with them. Otherwise everything is stock items until now. I believe it is all very simple. Maybe I should just leave the coil outside the tool box and put the rest inside. All this originates from my plans to move the battery down between the gearbox and the inner mudguard, and this requires more room than the current location of the coil can deliver.

Thanks everybody for all the input.

All the best
Jacob


--- In [hidden email], Lee Eldridge <egdirdle@...> wrote:

>
> Good idea  to keep the coil HT away from everything. A spark over is the worst issue as it MIGHT destroy the semiconductor devices. Unlikely but possible.
>
> If you have a traditional machine there is very little the radiation from the HT lead or breakers lead can upset. If there is a computer or "high tech" flasher then you may have issues. simple rectifiers, shunt regulators (lamp regulator) are passive devices and are unlikely to be interfered with. The regulator for the rest is also comprised of mostly passive devices but the SCR MAY see a trigger but I have experience designing control circuits for lasers that had 100kv pulses (bike is at best 40kv) and the SCR circuits ran without an issue unlike the "digital" systems that were always failing.
>
> The breakers lead carries high currents that can induce a signal into the other wires. It is best t keep this away rom other stuff. Usually with these machines where the frame is ground return, you cannot twist with ground wire to cancel the magnetic field. No point putting shielding.
>
> The radiation from the HT lead is electric so shielding could work but keeping the isolation distances is hard. Selecting the right shield material is hard. Every time you double the distance from the HT lead to the equipment and wires you reduce the field by 4 times so every bit of spacing is good.
>
>
> Lee Eldridge
> Australia
> lee@...
> 0427874796
>
>
>
>
>
> On 09/10/2012, at 5:39 AM, Jacob wrote:
>
> > Rearranging the electrical divices
> >
> > I'm planning to rearrange all the electrical devices underneath the seat. I would like to move the lot into the left side tool box together with the ignition coil.
> > The question is: wiil the ignition coil and especially the HT lead interfere with the rectifier, regulator, head lamp ACDC regulator and flasher unit if the are placed too close to each other?
> >
> > Thanks for all inputs.
> >
> > All the best
> >
> > Jacob, Bulleteering in Denmark
> >
> >
>


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Re: one more electrical question

JOHN MEAD
If you mount the Podtronics on a piece of 1/4"(5mm) aluminum, before attaching it to the inside of your tool box, it will act as a larger heatsink.

John Mead

--- On Tue, 10/9/12, Jacob <[hidden email]> wrote:

> From: Jacob <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Enfield] one more electrical question
> To: [hidden email]
> Date: Tuesday, October 9, 2012, 2:38 PM
> John, I have checked out the
> Podtronic. Smart little thing. On the US web site it says
> not to install in in a closed room (tool box). At a british
> web site it says: install it in the tool box and get rid of
> it. This sort of little divice it something to go on with.
>
> Lee, thank you for the technical explanation. This is
> something that really makes me understand the different
> problems to be aware of when my electrcal rebuild is going
> to take places. I have LED flashers with a flasher unit to
> go with them. Otherwise everything is stock items until now.
> I believe it is all very simple. Maybe I should just leave
> the coil outside the tool box and put the rest inside. All
> this originates from my plans to move the battery down
> between the gearbox and the inner mudguard, and this
> requires more room than the current location of the coil can
> deliver.
>
> Thanks everybody for all the input.
>
> All the best
> Jacob
>
>
> --- In [hidden email],
> Lee Eldridge <egdirdle@...> wrote:
> >
> > Good idea  to keep the coil HT away from
> everything. A spark over is the worst issue as it MIGHT
> destroy the semiconductor devices. Unlikely but possible.
> >
> > If you have a traditional machine there is very little
> the radiation from the HT lead or breakers lead can upset.
> If there is a computer or "high tech" flasher then you may
> have issues. simple rectifiers, shunt regulators (lamp
> regulator) are passive devices and are unlikely to be
> interfered with. The regulator for the rest is also
> comprised of mostly passive devices but the SCR MAY see a
> trigger but I have experience designing control circuits for
> lasers that had 100kv pulses (bike is at best 40kv) and the
> SCR circuits ran without an issue unlike the "digital"
> systems that were always failing.
> >
> > The breakers lead carries high currents that can induce
> a signal into the other wires. It is best t keep this away
> rom other stuff. Usually with these machines where the frame
> is ground return, you cannot twist with ground wire to
> cancel the magnetic field. No point putting shielding.
> >
> > The radiation from the HT lead is electric so shielding
> could work but keeping the isolation distances is hard.
> Selecting the right shield material is hard. Every time you
> double the distance from the HT lead to the equipment and
> wires you reduce the field by 4 times so every bit of
> spacing is good.
> >
> >
> > Lee Eldridge
> > Australia
> > lee@...
> > 0427874796
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 09/10/2012, at 5:39 AM, Jacob wrote:
> >
> > > Rearranging the electrical divices
> > >
> > > I'm planning to rearrange all the electrical
> devices underneath the seat. I would like to move the lot
> into the left side tool box together with the ignition coil.
>
> > > The question is: wiil the ignition coil and
> especially the HT lead interfere with the rectifier,
> regulator, head lamp ACDC regulator and flasher unit if the
> are placed too close to each other?
> > >
> > > Thanks for all inputs.
> > >
> > > All the best
> > >
> > > Jacob, Bulleteering in Denmark
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Your personal settings are at:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/royalenfield
> Our old messages are at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/royalenfield/messages
> To unsubscribe, send a blank email to
> [hidden email]
>  Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>     [hidden email]
>
>
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Re: one more electrical question

Jacob-73
John, what a nice and simple solution. Thanks.

Jacob

--- In [hidden email], John Mead <john.mead@...> wrote:

>
> If you mount the Podtronics on a piece of 1/4"(5mm) aluminum, before attaching it to the inside of your tool box, it will act as a larger heatsink.
>
> John Mead
>
> --- On Tue, 10/9/12, Jacob <jacobtuelarsen@...> wrote:
>
> > From: Jacob <jacobtuelarsen@...>
> > Subject: Re: [Enfield] one more electrical question
> > To: [hidden email]
> > Date: Tuesday, October 9, 2012, 2:38 PM
> > John, I have checked out the
> > Podtronic. Smart little thing. On the US web site it says
> > not to install in in a closed room (tool box). At a british
> > web site it says: install it in the tool box and get rid of
> > it. This sort of little divice it something to go on with.
> >
> > Lee, thank you for the technical explanation. This is
> > something that really makes me understand the different
> > problems to be aware of when my electrcal rebuild is going
> > to take places. I have LED flashers with a flasher unit to
> > go with them. Otherwise everything is stock items until now.
> > I believe it is all very simple. Maybe I should just leave
> > the coil outside the tool box and put the rest inside. All
> > this originates from my plans to move the battery down
> > between the gearbox and the inner mudguard, and this
> > requires more room than the current location of the coil can
> > deliver.
> >
> > Thanks everybody for all the input.
> >
> > All the best
> > Jacob
> >
> >
> > --- In [hidden email],
> > Lee Eldridge <egdirdle@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Good idea  to keep the coil HT away from
> > everything. A spark over is the worst issue as it MIGHT
> > destroy the semiconductor devices. Unlikely but possible.
> > >
> > > If you have a traditional machine there is very little
> > the radiation from the HT lead or breakers lead can upset.
> > If there is a computer or "high tech" flasher then you may
> > have issues. simple rectifiers, shunt regulators (lamp
> > regulator) are passive devices and are unlikely to be
> > interfered with. The regulator for the rest is also
> > comprised of mostly passive devices but the SCR MAY see a
> > trigger but I have experience designing control circuits for
> > lasers that had 100kv pulses (bike is at best 40kv) and the
> > SCR circuits ran without an issue unlike the "digital"
> > systems that were always failing.
> > >
> > > The breakers lead carries high currents that can induce
> > a signal into the other wires. It is best t keep this away
> > rom other stuff. Usually with these machines where the frame
> > is ground return, you cannot twist with ground wire to
> > cancel the magnetic field. No point putting shielding.
> > >
> > > The radiation from the HT lead is electric so shielding
> > could work but keeping the isolation distances is hard.
> > Selecting the right shield material is hard. Every time you
> > double the distance from the HT lead to the equipment and
> > wires you reduce the field by 4 times so every bit of
> > spacing is good.
> > >
> > >
> > > Lee Eldridge
> > > Australia
> > > lee@
> > > 0427874796
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 09/10/2012, at 5:39 AM, Jacob wrote:
> > >
> > > > Rearranging the electrical divices
> > > >
> > > > I'm planning to rearrange all the electrical
> > devices underneath the seat. I would like to move the lot
> > into the left side tool box together with the ignition coil.
> >
> > > > The question is: wiil the ignition coil and
> > especially the HT lead interfere with the rectifier,
> > regulator, head lamp ACDC regulator and flasher unit if the
> > are placed too close to each other?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks for all inputs.
> > > >
> > > > All the best
> > > >
> > > > Jacob, Bulleteering in Denmark
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Your personal settings are at:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/royalenfield
> > Our old messages are at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/royalenfield/messages
> > To unsubscribe, send a blank email to
> > [hidden email]
> >  Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >     [hidden email]
> >
> >
>